Making Room by Gather
Hospitality. What do you think of when you hear that word?
For some it's old school 'stuffy' entertaining for others it's something to do with the hotel industry. One thing is for sure, as a culture we're not talking about it much.
Food * Design * Relationships have seemed to have taken a back seat to what our culture focuses on and values yet...we find ourselves in the midst of a loneliness epidemic. Something has to change, it's time to get back to our tables, and we're making room for it!
Making Room by Gather invites you into a new conversation on everyday hospitality. One that rewrites the way we approach opening your doors and filling your tables. Shifting the narrative from 'how does this make me look' to 'how does this make you feel' these buildable conversations aspire to inspire connection through everyday gathering.
Kayty's chic and a little quirky interview style will make you feel like you're sitting with a friend talking about how to grow in confidence as an everyday host. You can expect conversations from navigating challenging relationship dynamics to foundational cooking techniques and everything in between.
Whether you are a seasoned host or looking to develop new friendships and grow in your skills for the first time, there is a seat at the table. Join us weekly for new conversations with expert guests and with Kayty in her beloved Date with Kayt episodes. Continue the conversation @gatheritentionalliving
Making Room by Gather
The Mental Load: Navigating Marriage After Kids w/ Dr. Morgan Cutlip
Feeling buried under the invisible weight of family life? You're not alone. Dr. Morgan Cutlip joins us for a raw, honest conversation about the unspoken reality of marriage after children.
This conversation tackles the infamous "mental load" – that seemingly endless running to-do list. Dr. Cutlip brilliantly breaks it down into three overlapping domains: physical tasks, mental planning, and emotional labor. The "triple threat" tasks requiring all three simultaneously explain why parenthood can feel so depleting. And yes, she confirms, this directly impacts desire and intimacy in ways other mental load discussions rarely address.
What sets this discussion apart is the practical hope it offers. Rather than falling into what Dr. Cutlip calls the "hardship Olympics" where partners compete over who has it worse, she offers tools to break cycles of resentment that trap many couples.
Dr. Cutlip's upcoming book "A Better Share" promises a refreshing approach that views couples as teammates against the impossible standards of modern parenting rather than opponents. For anyone feeling lost in the fog of early parenthood or wondering if their relationship struggles are normal – this conversation offers validation, practical tools, and most importantly, the assurance that you can find your way back to connection.
Pre-order Dr. Morgan Cutlip's book "A Better Share: How Couples Can Tackle the Mental Load for More Fun, Less Resentment and Great Sex" available April 8th, 2025, wherever books are sold.
Follow Morgan @drmorgancutlip
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This episode is sponsored by Feast and Fettle
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Hey everyone, welcome back to Making Room. I am so excited that you're here. This conversation, man, oh man. We've had some marriage conversations on the show, but none quite like this one. You probably roll your eyes every time I bring up a Wesley story. You guys know that I am in the thick of postpartum and recently Colby and I are realizing, the more we talk to friends in seasons like ours, the same narrative comes up that there is a strain in a relationship that kind of surprises us or surprises our friends in our life, kind of like nobody talks about it. It's one of those things going into parenthood that people don't talk about as freely and I wish they did, which is why we're making room for that conversation today with our new friend, morgan Cutlip. If you guys followed us on, if you follow us on socials, actually, you'll know that Colby and I actually just launched a parents night out to work towards this very thing supporting marriages with parents that have young kids, and so this is all coincidental. I didn't plan it to line up like this, but it is a really sweet time because of our heartbeat in the season, something that I hope encourages you to.
Speaker 1:Well, here is a little bit more about our new friend, dr Morgan Cutlip. She is an author and relationship expert. With her down-to-earth style, she equips couples and individuals to tackle the trickiest relationship issues, offering fresh perspectives and empowering frameworks. She's experienced and trained in translating psychological theory and research into practical, accessible and actionable advice so helpful which she shares with her clients and social media followers through her books, courses, podcast and her blog. As co-founder of mylovethinkscom, dr Morgan earned her master's in human development and family science and her doctorate in counseling psychology. She is the author of Love your Kids Without Losing Yourself. We all need a copy of that one and a mother of two incredible kids, wife to her high school sweetheart and lifelong lover of all things relationship. Her latest book that we are going to be talking about today, a Better Share, will be available nationwide April 8th 2025.
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Speaker 2:Hi, I'm Katie, a hospitality educator and the host of Making Room by Gather podcast. I am set to see our communities get back to the table through hospitality, but it wasn't always this way. My husband and I moved to Thailand and through it I experienced some loneliness and with it I was given a choice to sit back and accept it or to do something about it. And for me that meant two things that I needed the healing to learn how to accept an invitation and the confidence to know how to extend one. Through this process, I developed some of the richest and deepest relationships of my life. Through making room by gather, you will hear conversations from myself and experts in the areas of food, design and relationships. You see there are countless things trying to keep us from the table, but can I tell you something? Take a seat because you are ready, you are capable, you are a good host.
Speaker 1:Oh man, oh my look at us what a nice intro I love it, Thank you. Thank you so much. That was one of those. I don't even think I've told my listeners this. We had a different intro for like two years and I was in the shower one day and I just had this like inspiration and that was born like inspiration and that was born. That's how that happened.
Speaker 3:I love it. It's so true, though, like the confidence to extend an invitation is a real thing, so I loved it. Well done.
Speaker 1:Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. Well, I'm actually glad I'm doing a batch record right now, talking to a lot of amazing guests, and this is my last of the day, and I was thinking if I started my day with this one, I probably would have been teary. I woke up a little sleep deprived and this is such a important conversation and so you're just going to get I'm two cups of coffee in so I have more clarity a little less emotional.
Speaker 3:No matter how you show up, we're going to have a good conversation. Let's do it, yeah, okay.
Speaker 1:Well, let's kick off. I love starting with a backstory or some history. I think it's really important just in getting to know you. I studied social work. That's my major. I'm a sociology geek, a psychology nerd. I love it all In your bio. I love that you say that you take kind of like high level theory and break it down. But I'm a girl where I'm like no, no, no, give me like the, give me in raw form, because I just geek out, I geek it, I love all of it, but I want to hear more about your background. So what could take this, whatever direction you think is most relevant? What led you to either this book? What led you to study psychology? Where do you want to take it? I mean, I'll take it everywhere.
Speaker 3:So so my interest in psychology started way back when I was in like around second grade actually. So my dad went back to school to get his doctorate in psychology when I was growing up and I used to go to class with him sometimes and so I packed like a little toy briefcase filled with candy and paper and I would sit there and I would take notes and I just it was like such a special time with my dad. So it was a pretty long drive to campus and we would play this game. And we played this for many, many years where he would give me a hypothetical counseling case. So maybe it was a couple, maybe it was a family, maybe it was a little kid, and he would say what are you going to do? How are you going to help them? What do you think's going on? What do you think's going on with the little boy in the family? And we would analyze it. And it became just like this I was like obsessed with this game. So every time we get in the car I'd be like give me another case, let me talk it through. So I feel like I just grew up with this deep love for this work, the enjoyment of kind of like, analyzing it and picking it apart.
Speaker 3:And then my dad ended up a few years or many years, I guess, into his private practice, starting to develop relationship education courses. So way before like every single person online had a course. He was like teaching courses live and at conferences, and so I started traveling with him, sometimes I'd speak with him, I went to conferences with him marriage conferences from a pretty young age too, and so it just kind of grew up in the work and I knew I wanted to work alongside him and we did for about 15 years and I'll never forget I think I was in maybe like end of high school, early college, and we were driving home from one of the speaking engagements and I said, you know, I don't know what this looks like for me yet, but someday I really want to support women. It's like that's going to be my thing, like you got yours, this is going to be mine. And um, it really wasn't until I became a mom that I was like, oh, here it is and this is what I want to do, because I went into motherhood with very high expectations of myself and, um, a complete like, just like naive, naivete I can never say that word properly. I don't like to sound like naivete. It sounds ridiculous. But like I was naive going into motherhood thinking you know, whatever, I'll work right alongside my baby, I'll do the. You know, it's going to be simple, she's going to be easy. Like this whole idea of like even what my kid would be like.
Speaker 3:I had all of these sort of notions going into motherhood about what it would feel like to be a mom, what it looked like as a mom, how my kid would be, and they were just completely shattered. I was totally buried by motherhood. I felt completely, um, incapable and lost and in this fog and home I felt like a homesick feeling. I just felt so overwhelmed and I was like, okay, if I went into this with all this background, all this education, all this knowledge, and this is how I'm feeling. Moms most moms have to feel some sort of like piece of this too, and so that's my. My first book really has my heart in it. It's it's it's a really important book to me and I share a lot of my story and give a really practical framework for moms the other piece of it. So this is a longer intro than you said I love it.
Speaker 3:The other piece of it was that our marriage took a hit, so like I. So it's like I took a hit as an individual. I realized that I had to make changes in how I showed up, in my life and in my relationship if I was going to actually enjoy motherhood. Otherwise, I was going to not resent my kids, but sort of like resent what it has done to my life, if that makes sense. I love being a mom, but it just shakes things up so dramatically. But then also my husband took a job change.
Speaker 3:We were living in Florida at the time and when our daughter her name is Effie when she was two months old, he moved to California and I stayed behind until she was 10 months. So I did all that new stuff kind of on my own and um didn't involve him very much cause he was gone a lot, but also I was sort of like gatekeeping and um, he didn't jump in. Well, he was kind of like I don't know, you know, you do, I don't know what I'm doing. And I was like I don't know what I'm doing, like why are you? And so I I felt really irritated and resentful and frustrated and also the amount of responsibilities that pile on the immediately after kid is born is just mind-blowing, and so I was just buried by the changes motherhood brought, and I was really frustrated and overwhelmed by the changes that happened in my relationship and also the amount of responsibility. So that's really. Book two is about that piece of it, which is the mental load and how it impacts your relationship.
Speaker 1:I am so grateful that you're having this conversation. I think that a lot of these conversations could happen just from textbook or study. I'm not grateful for it, but grateful you know what I mean that you're using your story as kind of like a launching pad for it. I think it's important because you know the heart of the person that we're talking to today. But the timing of this conversation is crazy.
Speaker 1:Wesley is a year and a half and love him. Love him to pieces. He's like, he's the best, he's everything that I could have dreamed of and more. I'm one of three girls and a single mom, so we I came from all like girl energy, so this boy thing is new to me, but we we love him. But the relationship side, colby and I lived internationally together, which means that we had an international move both ways, lived there for just about four years, adjusted to a new culture, started a small business.
Speaker 1:Whenever you go through that checklist of life stressors, we hit basically everyone and that was like the start of our marriage. We realized nobody says or nobody kind of prepares you for the way that marriage or that parenting can strain a relationship. And so recently we've been like, oh my gosh, what in the world is happening and thankfully we have great communication. But we've talked to some of our other friends and the same narrative comes up. They're going through the same thing and they feel like there must be just something wrong with them or their relationship. It's an isolating thing. People feel totally alone or like they lack the skill whatever. There's a lot of like blaming, right of spouse or self. So I want to hear from you just to kind of like validate or affirm I don't know people listening how common is it for parents of young kids to experience strain in their relationship and why?
Speaker 3:It's the norm, so that people need to know that there's tons and tons I don't remember the last time it was studied because they just kept finding the same findings which is that after kids, um, marital satisfaction declines. And you shouldn't know, like I I I never really want to put energy or information out in the world. That is like a hope slasher. So you should know that that is a temporary shift. Um, there's other things that actually do change in a positive direction, like sort of like um, finding meaning in life actually increases after kids and those types of things. But, yeah, your relationship satisfaction dips for a bit, and so I feel like it's really important that we are now just there's a, there's a fundamental shift in the relationship where we're now having to uh, entertain and take care of somebody else's needs, and babies are just like a ball of meat. So it takes a lot of our energy and a lot of our focus, and so, um, it's really important to remember that.
Speaker 3:I think, in general, um, like a good rule of relationships to keep in mind is that life that is like absolutely no fault of anyone else.
Speaker 3:The good stuff, like you listed a bunch moves starting a business, renovating a home, having a baby, you know, an illness, like all of these parts of life that are not necessarily anyone's fault.
Speaker 3:They naturally just pull our relationships apart.
Speaker 3:They naturally drive a wedge and sort of imbalance or or like sort of like deflate the connections in our relationship.
Speaker 3:And so, um, we, we need to like have a movement that normalizes that so we don't feel so ashamed and also so that we can talk about it with people who are supportive of our relationships. And it also means that we actually have to be intentional about taking care of our relationship, because the danger isn't that we sort of end up in this sort of disconnected place. The danger is, if we just permanently stay there which is what happens to couples after kids who sort of become kind of like, you know, out of balance in the relationship, and then you know, 20 years later, the kids leave the house, or 18 years later or something, and they're like, oh, we just grew apart and it's like, well, you know, yeah, because you know you got in this busy season but you didn't work to come back together and so it's okay to be in this place, but you do need to work at managing your relationship be in this place, but you do need to work at managing your relationship.
Speaker 1:Why do you think it's not talked about Like? That's not like sexy to talk about or like normal to talk about Like? Is it because we think that we're the only ones?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think there's. Yes, I think that's part of it is like maybe we're worried to admit it out loud. You know it's almost like when you you can think stuff. But if you admit it out loud, you know it's almost like when you you can think stuff. But if you admit it out loud it feels like it makes it real, and I think there's a little bit of that.
Speaker 3:I think that there's a really a big fear of divorce in our culture. A lot of people actually, you know, avoid getting, you know, even commitment because of it. But I think there's a big fear of divorce. I think there's a big fear of divorce and so even like kind of going down that road in our mind or out loud, I think, can feel really scary.
Speaker 3:I think that also there's this sort of lie that we're fed that it's like parenthood like completes you, and I do believe that, becoming parents, we have the opportunity to become better than we ever would be on our own, because it's a relationship that challenges us and that that can be a really good thing. But, um, if we have this belief that, like, parenthood is idealized and then we're in it and we're like this is this is a lot and um also our merit feel like I'd never get to like enjoy my spouse or my partner anymore. Um it it feels like there's something wrong with you and instead of this just being a normal transition for for relationships, it's so important to kind of like spell that out and picture that in culture.
Speaker 1:Um, yeah, because it makes it a little bit more okay, I guess, right to have these conversations that we're encouraging people to have. So I, as I was preparing for this and even when you first came to my attention about, like the launch I just had this dream of hosting this conversation on a stage with a few couples live an audience of parents in this season, just to kind of like in person, in real time, just so saturate them with, like the truth that you're not alone.
Speaker 1:But for today, let's just kind of go through some of the basics that people might talk about in this season, like that parents might be experiencing, and offer some real solutions. So the first thing that I want to do, I always like to define terms that might be new to people, and so the first is a word that I love right now because it helps me define the season, but it's mental load.
Speaker 3:So how would you?
Speaker 1:As my literally Wesley's in the background playing and making noise. I'm like tell me what mental mode is.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I love that you said that about definition, because I think defining these invisible experiences gives us the, it empowers us to do something about them. So I'm like a big fan of creating language for stuff that we feel and experience. So, okay, I'm going to, if you're okay with it, I want to give the 30,000 foot definition and I want to give like the in the weeds. Okay, 30,000 foot definition is the mental load, is the seemingly never ending running to do list that um, in in the home and family life, predominantly women carry in the home, and it has two key features it's made up of a lot of invisible stuff, so kind of outside of awareness, and the invisibility piece also makes it hard to get appreciation and acknowledgement for all that's getting done. Sort of like things happen but nobody really knows how they. How is there toilet paper Again, who does this? It's like, yeah, we're doing it.
Speaker 3:The other piece is that it takes up cognitive real estate. So what this means is that it takes up space in our brains and it crowds out energy that we can put toward other things. So regulating our emotions, having patience, finding peace in our life memory. You know we're always like oh, mom brain, mom brain. It's like, well, yes, that's real, and also so is like your brain being so full you don't have the ability to remember as much. So it wears us, it depletes us. The other big thing that I do talk about in my book that no one's really talked about when it comes to mental load is that it crowds out space and energy, especially for women to find like a sexy state of mind. So it impacts our desire in a massive, massive way, which I think it needs to be a big part of the conversation around the mental load. So that's a big definition. Yeah, the reason why I like to give the in the weeds one is because what I find in, at least in my community, is two main things.
Speaker 3:Women have a really hard time explaining it to their partners. It's usually women coming to their partners to talk about it for a couple of reasons. One is like their partner gets defensive or they're like, yeah, well, I'm busy too. So it becomes like I call it the hardship Olympics, where it's like well, I'm tired, well you're, I'm tired, and then I worked all day and I did the. You know. It's like oh, my gosh, why are we arguing about this? Like we both are losing here. So that's one big piece. So the conversation gets shut down and and actually the the hurt. So like if a woman is coming to her partner to talk about this and she's feeling really overwhelmed, she's already like in not a good place, you know. She's already feeling maybe a little unsupported, and then if it's met with defensiveness or anything like that, it's just like game over. I mean, resentment is going to start to build pretty quickly.
Speaker 3:The other reason why it's important to give the in-depth definition is because men don't really understand it very well. And I'm not knocking men Like there's a perspective there too, but they don't understand it quite as much. And so when a woman is like okay, this is what's, I'm overwhelmed by this, this, this and this, and she lists like tasks, it feels kind of silly to her sometimes like, oh, these should be manageable. Why am I overwhelmed? So there's a level of self-judgment. And then when she speaks it out loud, a lot of times it's met with like well, then, just tell me what to do or just make me a list, and it's it's more involved than that, but people don't have the language.
Speaker 1:Okay, so it's good, this is good, go for it. Okay, I love it.
Speaker 3:I feel very strongly about this topic. Okay, so the mental load has three domains of tasks. So if you can imagine a Venn diagram with three circles, so the first is the physical, and that's like mowing the lawn, doing the laundry you actually physically carry the task out. The second is the mental and that's like making a list or the steps involved in a task. When you're like making that list or thinking them out, so it's like, um, you know, making a grocery list, thinking about what you need for dinner.
Speaker 3:I mean, dinner is dinner is way more involved than people understand, like it's so much work I hate, I hate it, I hate it. So, um, you know, or it's like work tasks are usually a mental, so it's like you know, respond to emails and work through my to-do list, whatever. The third is so they're overlapping, okay. And then the third is the kicker and that's the emotional and that's the one that men really don't get very well and this is like the thinking through the sort of like cause and effect analysis on behalf of your family members in an attempt to maximize positive outcomes. So it's like I'm sure, as your Wesley gets older, this is going to like pick up when you start thinking about schools and you start thinking about friendships, you start thinking about like what's going to impact their long-term development. And we're sort of like we even do it with dinner quite honestly.
Speaker 3:But I'm thinking through these like sort of high stakes things and the emotional load is really hard to explain because it requires that you think this way, it's hard to outsource because it requires a deep knowledge of the members of your family and it goes with you everywhere so you can work full time and still be weighing through the emotional stuff.
Speaker 3:So this is the last piece of this long winded explanation, but where the three circles overlap, I call it the triple threat, and the majority of tasks in the mental load of the home and family life are triple threat tasks. That means that they require mental, emotional and physical demands on us. So, if you imagine, it's like each task is like a tiny suitcase that unpacks all of these steps, and so this is why it's overwhelming. This is why it feels like your work is never done. This is why, if your partner doesn't understand it, they don't think through things in the same way. They're thinking kind of more like the physical piece. That's kind of how they see the tasks. So it becomes really draining and very overwhelming, and it makes it hard for women, I think, to feel like they can take a break.
Speaker 1:So I have a question. That's kind of playing off of that segwaying to the next part. So I had a friend early on in bringing Wesley home. She said lovingly I think she was trying to tell me nicely, warn me. Nicely she goes welcome to the rest of your life, always comparing who's sleeping less and working harder. And it's amazing to me how quickly this like you were saying that like resentment can just kind of like build and build and build. It's shocking, yep, and I feel like you don't necessarily notice like the slow creep, but all of a sudden you're like oh my gosh, we're like we're in this resentment kind of like comparison thing. I would love to know what are. You could take this. Whatever direction you think would be would answer this best. But I think my question would be what are the ways to communicate well and work towards health here?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so let's just do the whatever you want to call it. So it's like tit for tat or I said that once and someone's like that's a really old sounding phrase.
Speaker 1:No, I say it, I guess I'm really old, I don't know.
Speaker 3:But. Or the hardship Olympics, which is you're competing to have it harder and, um, I think I've been here because my husband, my husband, travels every week and and we don't do it anymore. Um, but we used, we used to very much get stuck in this because he would be so drained from traveling and I would be like, well, who do you think you know, kept everything going here, you know, felt sort of unseen. So I think, gosh, our relationships would just so benefit from like heaping amounts of grace and graciousness. And I think sometimes we struggle with that when we're really drained and we're tired and we're not feeling like we're being seen and appreciated.
Speaker 3:And so I think my advice for that tit for tat or the hardship Olympics is twofold. So the one, the first piece, is kind of like to shift your thinking. And the thinking shift is like it doesn't cost me anything to acknowledge my partner's difficulties, Like we have to remember that, like it doesn't take anything away from my difficulty if I say what you did was difficult. And I think that we, for some reason, we really do, if we're not thinking that consciously, we really do have that subconscious sort of thing of like if I give them the little inch, then they're going to get their head's going to get big, or they're going to be like, yeah, they're going to lean into it and rub it in, or like whatever you think it's going to like unravel, we're going to lose power.
Speaker 3:There's a lot of power dynamics in relationships that would sneak up on us, but so the first is remembering that to give a little bit to your partner takes nothing away from you. It doesn't devalue your experience. I think the other thing is that a lot of times when we enter into that interaction, I call it us having parallel needs, so it's like we both have the same need and they're just running alongside each other and somebody's got to jump over and meet the need first, and also it's just annoying. I do want to acknowledge like it's super annoying when this happens. It's annoying when, like, you express something like this and it's like, all of a sudden, your partner at that very moment needs to have this need to and you're like, well, great timing.
Speaker 2:It is really annoying.
Speaker 3:I don't want to ever brush over the fact that it's very frustrating, but the reality is, if you want to have an enjoyable experience in your relationship, if you want to get more from your relationship, sometimes you have to give a little bit more. And so you got to cross over to meet that parallel need. So if it's like for now, from now on, my husband, I have like completely shifted this. So if he comes home he's like I'm so exhausted, I'll just say you gotta be like, you gotta be tired. What you did was exhausting, Like I, I get it, man. And then later, if I say I'm so exhausted from you being gone, he'll be like yeah, you must be like. We just both feed each other and it doesn't cost either anything. And then and the more we resist doing that the sort of like, harder our partners will often dig their heels in and be less likely to give. So step, step over, meet the parallel need and see if things soften, so then you can also get what you need.
Speaker 1:Are there any tools that could help a mom that's overwhelming with or that's overwhelmed with mental load Like? Do you have any like day in and day out tools? Maybe that just came to mind.
Speaker 3:So I am like a um, I'm a little I give very practical tools in both of my books, Um, but I'm also like a big picture thinker. So that's kind of where I'm going to come from with this one, but my first. I feel like my books compliment each other really well because the first one is for moms and it's really about how do you manage your relationship with yourself. So, like historically, women kind of are really bad about speaking up for what they need. We're pretty bad about actually even knowing what we need and then, especially after become a mom, you sort of have to put yourself on the back burner just to keep your kid alive, but we get stuck there and so then we get really disconnected from ourselves and what we need. And so I think like one of the biggest pieces for women when it comes to the mental load is learning how to sort of like reconnect with yourself so you can step into your power and agency in your relationship. So it took like in my own life, it took me a long time to even feel like I had a right to ask for more participation from my husband, and I think that's pretty common and so, um, that that is, I think, one of the most important pieces.
Speaker 3:So in my first book I talk about, um, how moms need to really do a good job of regularly almost doing like a self check-in, or you can think of it like a self scan. So because we move through our world really thinking others, other, how can I meet your needs, how can I anticipate your needs? But like we become kind of invisible even to ourselves. So it's how do you do a quick self check-in? I give a five-step framework for doing that. But if you just think about this it's not too tricky to understand, which is like, take a minute, how am I doing emotionally? How's my energy mentally? Where can I turn the dials a little bit to make a difference?
Speaker 3:How can I define what's going on with me, Check in with myself, acknowledge myself and then decide how I want to move forward? So it's back to what you said early on, like that definition that empowers you to make a change. So in the book I give the definition for exactly how you do that check-in. But even if moms don't read the book and you just practice, like every day, multiple times a day, when you go to the bathroom and you change your diaper, like how am I doing? What's going on with me? What do I need? And start to develop back that relationship with ourselves. It goes a long way.
Speaker 1:Such important conversation. Well, you know, I really was thinking a lot about this conversation again because of the season that we're in and just hearing so many of our friends' conversations playing through my mind. But I was thinking about things like postpartum seasons for moms, or even going to a baby shower. There is almost I'm speaking very generally here but no conversation that has about marriage, like here's dinner for your family so you don't have to cook, not, hey, how are you guys doing? Or like getting ready for a baby shower. There's so much focus on positivity and celebration but very little prep about that, and that's a whole different conversation.
Speaker 1:I didn't feel prepped well for postpartum in general, even just healing wise, like the medical side of it for me. I was like nobody told me about that, right, yeah, so I really I think this might be the most important part of the conversation, potentially, depending on where people are at. How can we be the people that lead the charge on this and our own friends and in our families to better support the marriages of those around us? Like what, maybe questions, could we be asking what approaches to support them?
Speaker 3:Well, Hmm, that's a big question. So I I mean, I think um letting the people around you know we're like, you know, going through these moments, that you understand it. I think sometimes just telling our stories uh allows us to step into these conversations in a way that people know that they're safe to also share theirs and um, you know there's there's conversations that exist. I mean I I spent a lot of time at playgrounds with my kids were really little talking about there's a lot of conversations that exist that become sort of like complaining about our relationship, and sometimes we might need a little bit of that, but it's dangerous. It's a little dangerous to go there too much but to to really be a place where it's like you can speak to me about your relationship and I will hear you and I will um not judge it and I will let you know that this is normal and I will support, I will be pro relationship, um, pro both partners.
Speaker 3:I think it's important to have people like that in our lives and so when we tell our story, it helps, helps to do that. I mean, I think more on a bigger scale, I know in my own work it's like it's like my book, it's like talking about these things as much as I can. It's trying to offer um. You know my own story. I guess I'm doing it on a bigger scale. I I spoke um on last week at a marriage conference in front of like over 5,000 people and it was told them about the time my husband said he wasn't happy with her sex life and it's like I don't mind if my story will help to normalize something painful in your relationship. So it opens up avenues for you to have conversation that is productive and moving you toward greater connection and healing, and I'm happy to share that with you.
Speaker 1:So I think more of that a little bit more vulnerability. So I'm thinking like that could potentially look like someone saying like, hey, when we brought so-and-so home for the first time, like our kid home for the first time, our marriage really took a hit. Like if that happens to you guys, don't be surprised. Or like here's what helped us. Like I've kind of made a vow to myself to be the one that writes the downer baby shower note. Like courage to all my friends. Like here are the things to expect that no one told me to expect you know, including some of those things in there.
Speaker 1:I mean, there's a way to frame it Like you said, like not a way doom and gloom, but just eyes wide open.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I mean, you're no-transcript. How it is now is how it will always be, and so, um, I want parents out there to have hope that it's like it's. Even the research shows the drop in satisfaction is temporary. The trick is navigating this time without creating a permanent resentment or rift in your relationship that you can't get out of. It's navigating this early season while really being soft to one another and caring for your relationship, and that becomes sort of like the marching orders for this early season with kids.
Speaker 1:Another thing that's been hugely helpful to me is to be together as family units with other families in the same season, so we can hear their conversations, they could hear ours, and it's like, oh my gosh, like we have each other's backs, we're going through similar experiences and, man, it's so good, it's so important, it's important to make space for it is.
Speaker 3:It's really good, it is.
Speaker 1:What else in the book. You could take this any direction. Are you excited for people to experience?
Speaker 3:Oh gosh. So okay, a few things. There are a couple of books on the mental load that already exists. There's one in particular that's really, really a popular book, very popular. It's just genius solution to actually how you like delegate responsibility. So, like the practical, logistical side, like how do I hand off some of what I'm doing to my partner it is absolutely genius. The the.
Speaker 3:Where I'm wanting to add to the conversation and what I'm excited about with this book is that some people have a hard time even having that conversation because their partner is so defensive or because the the one partner feels so resentful already that it's like you can't have the conversation without it just spiraling into this argument, and so I think even equipping couples to tackle this conversation together is very important, and that's a big piece of what my book does. It will help your relationship in general. Um, it's it's very meaty in terms of, like the content and the practical tools, so that's one piece. Um, I haven't seen a book that actually helped couples really talk about it. And the other thing is like the mental load changes literally every day and definitely depending on what's going on in your life. So around the holidays, our mental load is exponentially bigger, or like December. November is like all our family's birthdays plus the holidays, and it's like I feel like I'm like losing my my mind, and so, because the mental load always changes, we have to be able to talk about it regularly. Can you imagine? Every time you bring it up it's a fight. What happens is women stuff it, they get resentful and they can't. They don't feel like their partner's safe, and when you don't feel like you're safe with your partner to come to them, it starts to deteriorate everything in the relationship. So it really equips couples in that way, which I'm excited about.
Speaker 3:The other piece is that if you consume any amount of content on this topic on social or mainstream media, it's pretty negative toward men, it's pretty. I find it condescending actually, and it really I haven't leaned into this yet in my own content, but I will and, um, I think it's, I think we're, it's a we're missing the mark. We're missing the mark because criticism isn't a good starting place for change, and so my book is different because it takes the position that it is you and your partner versus the world. Modern family life is absolutely bananas what we're expected to accomplish and to do and the standards we're supposed to uphold and the distraction of our devices is like a whole nother piece, that we have very high standards for our parenting. All of these things should be what we view as the enemy and each other are. We are on the same team versus this shared enemy. And so it takes that perspective which I've not seen anywhere and I think also will make it a lot more palatable for men to read the book. They're not going to feel like I'm being condescending, it's like no, I get it. There's perspective here.
Speaker 3:And then third piece is the sex piece. Nobody's you know it's we have to talk about. The mental load affects the entire relationship and it's going to affect your sex life. And when that starts to go it, it creates, um, oftentimes standoffs in the relationship or vulnerabilities, and so we have to talk about how these things all work together and give couples a plan to kind of move, move out of it. And so I'm pumped about my book.
Speaker 1:I am too. I get a lot of um, I love it. I love what I do. I love hosting these conversations and inviting people into them. Um, this was the first. I mean I've. I've seen a lot of books this year. There's none like this one, and I think it's an important time and stuff. It sounds like I'm choked up. I'm just it's an important time in culture to launch it too. I think, um, maybe just cause I'm hyper aware of it because of our season, but, um, it's really good yeah.
Speaker 3:I see your son yeah.
Speaker 1:Well.
Speaker 3:I think you're right. There's certain like there's just certain times where there's a buzz around something, and it is. There's a buzz around, I think, motherhood and women and what we experience in that domain of life. There's a buzz around the mental load, and so yeah, I mean I'm, I'm hopeful that you know it's. Anytime you launch a book, it's really interesting process but you just sort of like hope and pray that it gets in front of the right people, especially when you like have such belief in the message and how it will impact lives. And so yeah, that's, I'm just hoping that's what happens.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm excited for you. You know there's. Have you read the book A mom is born? Have you heard of that one? No, I don't think I've read that one. It's the most honest, um, uh book like that propels you into postpartum that I read. So I was given a lot of books and I felt like it was the most honest, and so I feel like people could give a copy of that book and a copy of yours. Yes, that would be the best bundle.
Speaker 3:Yes, and my first one too, because I think, like the first one I said, that that one is a real personal one. It's it gives moms a five-step plan to really care for themselves well, and I'm not talking about pedicures and bubble baths, and I take every tool that I offer and I apply it to how it, how it relates to your relationship with your kids, and then also how you how it relates to your relationship with your kids, and then also how you can translate that to your relationship with yourself. So the short summary is like it teaches moms how to mother themselves, like they mother their kids, and it's important we know how to do that, and especially in that early phase.
Speaker 1:I love a good bundle. I love a bundle too. Check out that other book you're talking about Basket man, that's my language. Well, we are going to attach a link to the book on our show notes and so wherever people are listening, you could head on over and get a copy of the book. Wherever books are sold, yes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and hopefully it's okay to say this, but I'm not sure when this releases. But pre-orders are like a really big deal to authors and I just realized this and I double checked my information. But when you pre-order on like Amazon, I don't know everywhere else but you don't even get charged until right before the book ships. So it's like there's no real impediment to pre-ordering, but it really, really supports the work of the author. And I also have and I can give you the link for this, but I have leak thank you gifts. So if you pre-order, you get the first two chapters on audio right away. I created a guide for people who have, like you or your partner, adhd and the mental load, because that brings up a whole different slew of issues, so to help couples who have ADHD as part of their relationship, and then some like printables to help with dinner and packing and things like that that are just annoying, take up space.
Speaker 1:Wow, yeah, I've learned so much about the pre-order process, and so I'm a huge supporter of well wanting to encourage our community in that direction too, so we will get this launched in advance of the launch. Thank you With that in mind, of course. Well, we end each of our conversations with the same three questions, and I'd love to hear your answers as well. The first one is something that you've eaten recently and loved.
Speaker 3:I have like a lot of food sensitivities, so this is like not exciting and this is super weird, but I eat a lot of beef and I've been putting honey on it and it's actually really delicious and I'm sure no one out there will want to try it, but it's actually really really good and so yeah, I know, are you a hot honey person?
Speaker 1:I've never done that. I mean I put it in tea. No, no, no, okay, so not I should. Okay, oh, tell me so, like Mike's hot honey, it has to be Mike's. Oh spicy, but it's not. I don't know how to explain it.
Speaker 3:It's not spicy like burn your tongue, but it has. You have to have it. I'll get it. I'll get some. Yeah, I like a little kick, like a kick. Yeah, yeah, it's sweet. That sounds awesome.
Speaker 1:So you're saying you put it on beef. I put Mike's Hot Honey on everything. I put it on my burgers. I put it on.
Speaker 3:Okay, you do too. It's good. A sweetness to beef is delicious.
Speaker 1:And on my pizza Mike's hot honey.
Speaker 3:What about on cheese? Do you ever put on cheese?
Speaker 1:I know people do, so I'm very sensitive.
Speaker 3:So I don't know, oh okay, well, I get it I know what was I just going to say, though?
Speaker 1:that I put it on Pizza beef and whatever. I put it on everything, but it can't be. It can't be the Trader Joe's one, it can't. Nothing has to be Mike's. Okay, you got it, I'm in. Oh yeah, I'm with you, and then I don't know where you get your beef. Do you do good ranchers at all?
Speaker 3:I haven't done good. Ranchers, I order. Right now I've been ordering from primal pastures.
Speaker 1:Oh, nice, great, yeah, had theirs. Um, good, ranchers are friends of ours and their ground beef, specifically, is my favorite ground beef. Yeah, I'll check it out.
Speaker 3:Thank you.
Speaker 1:How about something you found to be beautiful lately?
Speaker 3:So I just had to um drive very far to drop my kid's friends off somewhere, um, and as we're driving, so it's pretty warm, it's like in the 60s for us right now, but then when you drive you can see the mountains and they're covered in snow. So it's like the sun and the palm trees and then the snowy mountains, and I think that is just like one of the most beautiful parts of uh, california life, which is that, like all, of the landscape is so stunning.
Speaker 1:I could do snow if I had palm trees. Yeah, Last but not least, something you've discovered lately that you think everyone should know about a Netflix show Amazon purchase.
Speaker 3:I gosh, I okay, there's this facial oil that it's not recent. I've used it for a long time but I'm obsessed with it. Um, and it's not even very expensive and it's all handmade and hand batch. So I try to use really clean stuff. But it's this brand called Keat. It's Q E, t and um, I love their cleansing oil and then their daily hydrating oil. It's insane. It's so, so, so, so good. And then the other thing is is I recently got this um ice roller, but it's by the skinny confidential. That's travel. So it's like a cube and it has two lids, so like on either side it kind of pulls apart and there's two different rollers, so one's like flat and then one has a groove, so it like gets in your jawline and it's so delightful. Honestly, you can put it in your freezer, your fridge, and it's just. I'm pretty obsessed with it.
Speaker 1:I'll attach both of those. I got one of those like those like red light face sculptor, you know things the wand or the mask, the wand Ooh, I don't have one of those.
Speaker 3:And I got one of the dupe ones, you know it the wand or the mask. The wand Ooh, I don't have one of those.
Speaker 1:And I got one of the dupe ones. You know it's not like the main one that everyone's talking about and maybe this isn't good for him. But Wesley knows when I'm like doing it every morning and he wants me to put some on like his face. So I'm sculpting my jawline and his. So cute.
Speaker 3:So cute, no harm in that?
Speaker 1:Well, where do you want to send people to learn more?
Speaker 3:You can find me on Instagram, which is just Dr Morgan Cutlip. It's a D-R Morgan Cutlip. Cutlip is injury to the lip, that's how you spell it. That's also my website, which is drmorgancutlipcom. And then my book is called um a better share how couples can tackle the mental load for more fun, less resentment and great sex. And it's anywhere you buy books. So Amazon, barnes and Noble Christian books it's there too. Um, I think Amazon right now might be the best price, but, yeah, anywhere you get books.
Speaker 1:Oh, exciting, so so good. Well, guys, I hope that through this conversation you feel um seen. And, guys, I hope that through this conversation you feel seen and empowered maybe I don't know if that's the word I'm looking for but to kind of take charge of this conversation in your own homes and in your own friendships and relationships, because, my goodness, I feel like it could save a lot of marriages potentially and strengthen a lot of relationships. So we are so grateful that you guys tuned in this week. Be sure to share it and leave a review wherever you're listening, and we will see you next week.